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ozredhead62
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Posted on Sun, Dec 14, 2008 05:41

I was talking to a male friend the other night and he was telling me that he was seeing a woman on a casual basis for over a month now. He would see her regularly and enjoyed the intellectual, emotional and physical side of this relationship/friendship.

All good, till he said that he was still looking for a woman to have a relationship with as she was ?not his type of woman?.

Upon further questioning he told me that she had allowed him to pick her up at a bar and had slept with him the first night. Thus making her disqualified as suitable relationship material.

After I thumped him one, lol, we discussed this as I could not believe that he would think like this. Though he did agree that it was double standards, this is how he felt, that he did not want a relationship with someone he considered promiscuous.

Do we as women still face these double standards?

Men are not only allowed but encouraged to crow louder than a rooster in regards to their sexual conquests and have the freedom to express their sexual needs, while women are down graded and demoralized for doing the same.

On asking my friend when he would thought it was right for her to have got sexual with him, he could not answer anything definite, said when it felt right, maybe on the 2nd or 3rd date.

Does it make a woman promiscuous if she knows what she wants and sleeps with a man on the first date? Or can a woman who just holds out for the 3rd date, and then has sex, maintain her appearance of morality? What if she was doing this 2 or 3 times a month?

What would happen if woman used this as a judge of character on men, and disqualified all men that agreed to sleep with them as not suitable partner material?



Life is only as wonderful as you think it is.

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jjiggl
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Posted on Wed, Dec 31, 2008 20:23

Anyone who makes that kind of judgement when they are participating in the same action is a hypocrite. Choosing not to date the woman on a serious, ongoing basis was doing her a favor. I hope that she did not waste her time hoping that things would go further with him because he is not worth it.


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aimeefla
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Posted on Tue, Dec 30, 2008 13:07

Quoting ozredhead62:

Ok here goes, we had a long chat the other night.

He initiated, she actually refused him several times at first. He persited and seems quite proud of that fact.

He did not tell her his feelings will change afterwards, but did not promise anything either. Just told her he wanted her and really liked her.



OOOO MY so he kept at her until she gave in. I'm glad he lost her to someone more deserving that won't play games. I know he changed his mind afterwards, or did he? Anyway she is better off without a man that plays such games. Her first "NO" was sufficient and the second NO should have been proof enough for him. But it seemed not. UNFAIR of him if it went the way he says. Send him here !! We want to his hide LOL LOL LOL Natalie


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bluegirl2006
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Posted on Mon, Dec 29, 2008 15:56

Quoting ozredhead62:

Ok here goes, we had a long chat the other night.

He initiated, she actually refused him several times at first. He persited and seems quite proud of that fact.

He did not tell her his feelings will change afterwards, but did not promise anything either. Just told her he wanted her and really liked her.



Its guys like that that make me so glad I'm no longer in the dating pool. How totally UNFAIR of him. How is a girl supposed to win?


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ozredhead62
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Posted on Mon, Dec 29, 2008 13:22

Quoting petale46:

ozredhead62 : I have a question I'd like you to ask your friend and get back to me with it. Did he tell her that if they slept together his view of her would change?? Did he refuse her?? Who initiated?? If she did initiate, did he sent the message that he didn't want to?? P.S. Love you girl, read most of your blogs, but for God sakes, my old and decrepit and cannot read the little red font you're using on some of your post.


Ok here goes, we had a long chat the other night.

He initiated, she actually refused him several times at first. He persited and seems quite proud of that fact.

He did not tell her his feelings will change afterwards, but did not promise anything either. Just told her he wanted her and really liked her.



Life is only as wonderful as you think it is.

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ozredhead62
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Posted on Mon, Dec 22, 2008 06:27

OMG seemed to have stirred a hornets nest here. LOL

I will ask him some more of your questions but do have to tread gently as I have not told him I have blogged about him. :)

The latest news is that he saw her again the other night and while they were talking she said that she felt he was not what she was looking for in a man for a relationsip.

Well he was quite put out by all of this, he did not like it one bit. LOL

Will get back to you all soon with more updates.¿ I have had some of my posts vanish, so hopefully this one is still here when I get back.



Life is only as wonderful as you think it is.

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petale46
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Posted on Sat, Dec 20, 2008 21:16

Tom... It seems the problem you had with the lady is exactly the same as ozredhead62's friend... lack of communication. She was insulted because you didn't jump her and you were being a gentleman. If you had talked about it... Sex is still something important to me, something kind of sacred, certainly not something I share with everyone like I'd do a hand shake. I make that evedently clear to my potential dates. Doesn't mean I could not sleep with someone on a first date. It's just that for me to have great mind blowing sex, you need to really, really, down to your gut want the other person and that requires time to know them. A mind turns me on, his desire for me turns me on, if I don't feel those two things, then I'm not into sleeping with him. That's the way I am, I'm not saying it's THE WAY... but it sure is my way. You should not however that my bed is still almost perfectly new on one side... that should tell you something. But I accept that it is a consequence for wanting mind blowing sex instead of a simple physical release.


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petale46
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Posted on Sat, Dec 20, 2008 21:10

ozredhead62 : I have a question I'd like you to ask your friend and get back to me with it. Did he tell her that if they slept together his view of her would change?? Did he refuse her?? Who initiated?? If she did initiate, did he sent the message that he didn't want to?? P.S. Love you girl, read most of your blogs, but for God sakes, my old and decrepit and cannot read the little red font you're using on some of your post.


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petale46
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Posted on Sat, Dec 20, 2008 21:07

I think we are facing a catch 22 here. How many women have heard said to them or about other women, if she doesn't put out, then I won't wait for her and move on. Then there's the other side... if she puts out too fast, she's out. When was the last time you heard a men say I think I slept with her too fast and that she won't respect me in the morning. Or even less probable, I want her to wait at least two weeks before I sleep with her, but she's pressuring me. She says she won't but then she keeps on feeling me up and try to get into my pants. Of course there is a double standard, the same way I don't understand why I pay 5 or 10 dollars more then guys for jockeys that requires half the fabric. And why does that double standard still exist in 2008. Because we let it. Because we believe guys who tell us they want more then just sex. For God sakes, after one date, do you think he knows you... he doesn't?? So how can he know he wants more then sex. My problem with the whole thing is that men are genetically dishonest. They say they are interested when there not, they say they want more then sex when they don't, they say you're fantastic, but don't mean it... so we are always trying to guess what they are saying and what they are meaning. Sorry guys, I know you won't like this... But from my personal experience, it is the biggest problem I have with guys. I can't say all... but I'd say, when online, most guys lie. It's a sad but simple fact of life. So don't take them at their word and do only what you want, whatever pressure you feel. You don't want to sleep with him, don't. If he doesn't stick around because of that... he doesn't deserve you. In the end it's all about self worth, what you are ready to settle for. Know what you are getting and live with the consequences. You want to sleep with someone on the first date because it feels good... then don't fantasize about a second one... best chance are, there won't be one. Whatever he says.


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ozredhead62
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Posted on Sat, Dec 20, 2008 16:47

Quoting truefriendinme:

I figure if a man wants to "disqualify" me for sleeping with him on the first date, so be it. It's not too much of a tragedy to me. I, personally, will probably not encounter this type of judgement as I'm far too cautious sexually to sleep with a man on the first date. But, if the time is right, and I felt comfortable, who knows? I would hope that the men in this situation (or women) would at least make this very clear to their "disqualified" partners, so as not to allow someone to build up false hope. Now, THAT would be tragic! --True


Well according to him he has told her that it is something just casual, though I am not sure if he told her why he felt this way.

What I find really tragic here is that he talks about her quite a bit, thinks she is fantastic, loves talking and spending time with her as much as the physical side of the relationship, but wont let himself get past this unjust moral code he seems to have accepted.

Maybe he has to lose what he has to wake up to himself?



Life is only as wonderful as you think it is.

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ozredhead62
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Posted on Sat, Dec 20, 2008 07:30

Quoting aimeefla:

Oz, would you ask him how he would judge the if she "played" along with the game and told him no, after he did his best to get the lady in bed just to see if she would surrender to his romance?? Then how he might think she will feel when she realizes that he was "testing" her? Why is it necessary to play the games? I read so many profiles that say "no game players" yet, now I might think that they men are the game players to see if we will hope into the sack with them on the first, second or third date. Sophomoric rubbish I say. Yup, you stuck a nerve LOL LOL Nat

¿

Well Nat, I do know what you mean about hitting nerve, and I did thumps him a few more times for you all.? I wont bonk him because here in Oz ?bonk? means something else completely?its mean the thing he got on that first date.? LOL

Now to me this does sound like playing games, and having someone expect you to act different than you want to just because of some hidden rules that they have.

I asked him how he would feel if he was disqualified for wanting to sleep with a woman on the first date, and how he felt if she encouraged him just to test him?? Well surprise, surprise, he did not like the idea at all, thought that this was unfair as she would be giving him confusing signals.

I think I was a bit shocked back by his attitude over all, guess because we were friends he felt safe to tell me.? I do wonder how many other men hold this double standard.? Not many have been brave enough to answer here.



Life is only as wonderful as you think it is.

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butterbll
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Posted on Wed, Dec 17, 2008 11:07

Yes it is a double standard.I feel in the society now every one in in a extreme rush to Do the nasty. Few nowdays will take the time and effort to Really get to know the person that they are trying to date. Most older folks(those over 50) will probilly tell you that Most of the people they had gone out with took their time. It was not uncommon for a couple to go "sparking" for a extended amount of time.One reason because of the Social Stigma of a woman being "LOOSE" Now it is a badge of honor for some. Several I had one time gone out on a first date a woman I was the "Perfect Gentleman" which I thought she wanted. To make a long story short.After the first date ended I tried to call her and emil her I was either blocked or hung up on. Later I found out from the posts in the chat room we both visited.The info that I was receving made it crystal clear why I was getting the response I was . From the multiple Flaming and , Nasty posts she posted. I was able to determine : She got mad at me because I did not jump her bones that night. She was upset that I supossedly led her on as to what I wanted. So there is a double standard.To coin a phrase on how I feel to proceed in relationships is the same for Good BBQ "LOW and Slow ". I feel the same applies to any relationship. For if one goes too fast with the "heat"( having Sex) the meat(relationship) will dry up and burn making it unpalatable. doing so thus ends any chance at any longlasting meaningful relationship.


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aimeefla
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Posted on Tue, Dec 16, 2008 16:43

Oz, would you ask him how he would judge the if she "played" along with the game and told him no, after he did his best to get the lady in bed just to see if she would surrender to his romance?? Then how he might think she will feel when she realizes that he was "testing" her? Why is it necessary to play the games? I read so many profiles that say "no game players" yet, now I might think that they men are the game players to see if we will hope into the sack with them on the first, second or third date. Sophomoric rubbish I say. Yup, you stuck a nerve LOL LOL Nat


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aimeefla
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Posted on Mon, Dec 15, 2008 12:27

I'd also like to add one more thing, Men will wine and dine us. they will say things to "lead" us to the bedroom. THEN disqualify us? Yes, bonk him one - no twice for me !!!! Nat


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aimeefla
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Posted on Mon, Dec 15, 2008 12:25

Quoting bigtom77:

Well Oz, It looks like you did it again, you sure come up with some toughies, don't you? I would like to start by answering the last part 1st: if men were judged with the same standards as women there would be no partenerships past the 1st date. OK I said it, there. I am not a bar person anymore and when I was I never picked anyone up, it just isn't my thing. Until after my divorce I never kissed on a 1st date much less slept with someone. I will admit that the first woman I dated after the divorce changed my no kissing rule, her idea not mine. but I can still say that I have never had sex on a first date. (doesn't leaving the house and coming back an hour later mean it's a 2nd date?) Just joking ladies do not come looking to thump my head now. As far as crowing goes, thats not me either, I just don't get that. Why are all these guys bragging about who they sleep with? Personally I don't want anyone to know because they might try to steal her from me. When? That is a good question, I have been in relationships where it felt right on the 2nd date, some the 3rd and I remember one where it was like date number 9 or 10 before it felt right. I have never had a one night stand and I have never been in a short term relationship with someone I sleep with. The shortest I have had was nearly six months and she moved is why that one ended so soon. I know I am not a typical guy, I think these things prove that but I just can't do women the way some guys do. It's just not in me.---Tom


Tom there should be more men like you in this world - Thanks for the sanity that should be contagious. I'm sure that the double standard will dwell in our world for a long time to come. Men teach their son's, TV show portray role models sadly. History is taught with the same values. It's a part of our society, woven into the fabric to create the picture that we all live. Nat


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Posted on Mon, Dec 15, 2008 06:37

Sadly, ladies this is true. Many men do have these guidelines about women. Sure, they are fast enough to try to get sex on the first date or accept it if the woman makes the move on them however, most will then either view us as only a booty call or a one night stand never to be seen again. The funny thing is that men like this come in all sorts of packages. You would think just skeezy, one liner type men would treat a woman that way. Well, not so. I have even been victem of that. I met a guy in the past and we are talking and laughing and he is not being offensive or coming on strong and I just got a feeling like we had some chemistry and I wanted to take it further then because it felt right to me...then I never saw him again or we had a few more dates and he conveniently made his exit. I am sorry to say it, but I think as women we need to protect our treasures and even though the guy may not realize it but us having sex with them or "giving it up" is a gift. It is something special and sacred that we choose to share with them. We don't share it with any guy that wants it or come with flowers in one hand and a his halo in the other. LOL.The problem is that it hard to tell who is going to disgard your gift and who will cherish it, and the only way to tell is with time. So, I am all for womans lib and the roaring and stuff, but I think this just one that we need to hold onto until he earns it. Not by making us laugh or buying us dinner or drinks- earns it by not pushing for it, earns it but showing sincere interest in the other aspects of our personality and wanting us for the total package that we are.


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bigtom77
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Posted on Mon, Dec 15, 2008 01:33

Well Oz, It looks like you did it again, you sure come up with some toughies, don't you? I would like to start by answering the last part 1st: if men were judged with the same standards as women there would be no partenerships past the 1st date. OK I said it, there. I am not a bar person anymore and when I was I never picked anyone up, it just isn't my thing. Until after my divorce I never kissed on a 1st date much less slept with someone. I will admit that the first woman I dated after the divorce changed my no kissing rule, her idea not mine. but I can still say that I have never had sex on a first date. (doesn't leaving the house and coming back an hour later mean it's a 2nd date?) Just joking ladies do not come looking to thump my head now. As far as crowing goes, thats not me either, I just don't get that. Why are all these guys bragging about who they sleep with? Personally I don't want anyone to know because they might try to steal her from me. When? That is a good question, I have been in relationships where it felt right on the 2nd date, some the 3rd and I remember one where it was like date number 9 or 10 before it felt right. I have never had a one night stand and I have never been in a short term relationship with someone I sleep with. The shortest I have had was nearly six months and she moved is why that one ended so soon. I know I am not a typical guy, I think these things prove that but I just can't do women the way some guys do. It's just not in me.---Tom


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truefriendinme
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Posted on Sun, Dec 14, 2008 20:04

I figure if a man wants to "disqualify" me for sleeping with him on the first date, so be it. It's not too much of a tragedy to me. I, personally, will probably not encounter this type of judgement as I'm far too cautious sexually to sleep with a man on the first date. But, if the time is right, and I felt comfortable, who knows? I would hope that the men in this situation (or women) would at least make this very clear to their "disqualified" partners, so as not to allow someone to build up false hope. Now, THAT would be tragic! --True


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smoosh
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Posted on Sun, Dec 14, 2008 11:25

Can't answer this question right now as I'm ticked at your friend - lol. So was he not promiscuous by sleeping with this pickup the first night ? Hope his lady friend knows she's not considered adequate due to her sexual prowess. So tired of the double stanard. Give him a thump for me too ok. Hope he doesn't meet two many 1st dates like this that he partakes in cause he's just as guilty.


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luvu2licme4xs
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Posted on Sun, Dec 14, 2008 06:49

HI RED, UNFORTUNATELY THIS TYPE OF THINKING ABOUT WOMEN IS VERY COMMON, AMONGST BOTH MEN & MANY WOMAN. I BELIEVE IF WE USED THE SAME STANDARDS TO JUDGE MEN, THERE WOULD BE EVEN FEWER SERIOUS RELATIONSHIPS IN THE WORLD THAN NOW. ITS SAD THAT WOMEN WHO EXPRESS THEIR SEXUALITY FULLY ARE CONSIDERED WHORES, SLUTS ETC. WHILE MEN WHO DO THE SAME ARE CALLED STUDS. THESE DOUBLE STANDARDS IN LIFE ARE SO RIDICULOUS, WHEN WILL PEOPLE GROW UP? AS FOR ME, IM NOT ONE TO JUDGE PEOPLE NOR DO I CARE MUCH ABOUT HOW PEOPLE PERCEIVE ME. TO BE HONEST, I FIND THAT MOST OF THE MEN WHO JUDGE ME ARE THE ONES WHO WANT ME, OR HAVE ALREADY BEEN REJECTED BY ME. LONG STORY SHORT, DO WHAT MAKES YOU HAPPY AND SATISFIED AND JUST KEEP MOVING.


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